Novelist Debbie Macomber: Forget Writing!

Macomber was told to forget about her dream as an author. But her undying persistence triumphed. Hear her uplifting story as she shares her God inspired journey through the frustrations and disappointments on her way to being one of the most prolific writers of our time. Debbie has sold over 200 million books and and spent over 1000 weeks on the NYT best sellers list over the past 20 year. This humble and joyful interview will warm your heart.

Holiday 2021 book is available now on Amazon. A special holiday wish list brings about hope, love, and second chances in this nostalgic novel from the queen of Christmas stories, number one New York Times best-selling author Debbie Macomber.

To order any of the hundreds of Debbie Macomber books, you can find them all on AMAZON.

DEBBIE MACOMBER AT A GLANCE

Bestselling author, storyteller, knitter, philanthropist, and woman whose writing and life are deeply shaped by her Christian faith.

Topics

Writing • Dyslexia • Faith • Rejection • Perseverance • Family • Prayer • Knitting • Charity • Hallmark • Cedar Cove

Her Faith & Writing Journey

Dyslexia and early discouragement → discovers knitting and creativity → secretly dreams of becoming an author → years of rejection → chooses perseverance → breakthrough book sale → bestselling career → prayer and faith remain central to her writing.

This Episode Explores

• How dyslexia shaped Debbie Macomber's life

• Why she considers dyslexia a gift

• The teacher who told her she wouldn't do well in school

• Being discouraged from becoming an author

• How knitting gave her confidence and skills

• Wayne Macomber's encouragement to keep writing

• The devastating rejection that nearly ended her dream

• The book that finally launched her career

• How her novels became Hallmark movies and Cedar Cove

• Debbie's daily prayer, Bible-reading and journaling routine

• Her knitting ministry through World Vision

• Why she prays over every book she writes

• How Christian values have shaped her career

Questions Answered

• Who is Debbie Macomber?

• How did Debbie Macomber become an author?

• How did dyslexia affect Debbie Macomber?

• Why does Debbie Macomber consider dyslexia a gift?

• Who encouraged Debbie Macomber to keep writing?

• How did Debbie Macomber overcome rejection?

• What book launched Debbie Macomber's writing career?

• How did Cedar Cove become a television series?

• How does faith influence Debbie Macomber's writing?

• What is Debbie Macomber's daily devotional routine?

• What is Knit One, Bless Two?

• Why does Debbie Macomber pray over her books?

• How does Debbie Macomber respond to criticism?

Core Story

Debbie Macomber's journey from a child who struggled to read and was discouraged from pursuing writing to one of the world's most successful authors is a story of perseverance, faith and unexpected doors opening. She describes God as the source of her inspiration and believes her dyslexia, creativity and storytelling ability were all part of God's plan. Through years of rejection, family challenges and career uncertainty, she continued writing—and ultimately built a bestselling career while staying true to her Christian values.

Podcast Transcript: Debbie Macomber — Faith, Rejection & Becoming a Bestselling Author

Amazing Greats with Ric Hansen

Introduction

Ric Hansen:All right, this is the Amazing Greats podcast. Thank you, Joe Michaels, for that great introduction.

We have an amazing guest once again this week—somebody who I have become, like I mentioned to you before, a Debbie expert. I've seen so many videos and so much about you that I feel like we know each other really intimately, although we've never met face-to-face until now.

So welcome to the Amazing Greats podcast.

Debbie Macomber:Oh, thank you. I'm really glad to be here. It's kind of fun.

Debbie Macomber: A Remarkable Writing Career

Ric Hansen:I'm going to tell our listeners a little bit about you for those who don't know the whole story. And for some who are already fans, they may not really know the whole story. So maybe this will enlighten them about who and what you are, where you've been, and what you do.

Our amazing guest is probably, I would say, one of the most prolific authors of our time.

She's been on the New York Times bestseller list for a thousand weeks over 19 years, has sold in the neighborhood of 200 million books, has written 18 book series, which include a total of 100 books, plus 74 standalone novels and ten nonfiction books, including books on knitting, cookbooks and inspirational books.

And, oh yeah, there are the 22 different anthologies that she's also written.

Her Cedar Cove book series was turned into an award-winning three-season television series. Five of her novels have been made into Hallmark television movies.

And you're probably asking, "What does she do in her spare time?"

She's also worked with World Vision, fundraises for battered women's shelters, is a national board member for Warm Up America, and was appointed an ambassador for Big Brothers Big Sisters of America.

Debbie and her husband, Wayne, have four grown children and 11 grandchildren.

What keeps you sane, Debbie?

Debbie Macomber:I think probably the inspiration—just God. You know, that's the source. He is my source.

An Unlikely Beginning

Ric Hansen:That is so cool.

I'm glad that you're here to share with us not only about your career and how amazing that is, but also how your faith journey has intersected with your career and your life.

Let's start at the beginning. It's an unlikely start to an author who is now so successful, and that was that you were told, "Don't do this."

Tell us that story back in school.

Debbie Macomber:It started—I have two, probably three, profound moments in my 12 years of school.

The first was third grade, because I'm dyslexic. I didn't learn to read until I was in the fifth grade.

I mean, when you think about it, isn't that something God does? He takes the most unlikely person—Moses, who stutters—and asks him to go to Pharaoh to present his case.

And then He takes somebody who couldn't learn to read until I was ten years old and makes her a bestselling author.

My third-grade teacher told my mother, "Debbie's a nice little girl, but she's never going to do well in school."

And I didn't. It was a self-fulfilling prophecy.

The one thing that changed for me was in the eighth grade. At about age 11 or 12, I started knitting.

No one in my family knitted, and I'm sure this was something God planted in my heart.

My mother, after I pestered her all one summer, took me down to the local yarn store and I learned to knit.

By learning to knit, I gained some badly needed self-esteem, a sense of accomplishment, mathematical skills and comprehension skills.

That was a turning point for me.

When I was in the eighth grade, the teacher saw all the things that I had knitted and was so impressed that she had a fashion show with the things I had made.

That was probably the highlight of my school year.

Being Told She Shouldn't Become an Author

Debbie Macomber:Then the last thing happened when I was a senior in high school.

The principal interviewed each one of us before graduation to ask us what we were going to do in the future—what our career path was.

I already knew college wasn't for me. I feel grateful to have graduated from high school.

And I had never told anybody I wanted to be an author.

For years, I had gone to sleep every night making up stories in my mind.

Again, this is God. He balances everything out.

The dyslexia and the trouble that I had learning to read—on the other side, I have a very creative imagination and I'm a storyteller.

When I told Sister Anna Marie that I wanted to be an author, she didn't say the words out loud, but she looked at me as if she were saying, "I want you to go home and think very seriously about this."

What I heard was, "You need to think along the lines of something more in line with your intelligence level."

Ric Hansen:Oh, man.

Debbie Macomber:The best part of that is that she lived long enough to see my published books.

Dyslexia as a Gift

Ric Hansen:In fact, at one point you've said that dyslexia was actually a gift.

Debbie Macomber:Absolutely.

That, too, is very much in God's plan for my life, that He gave me this.

I say I'm so right-brained, I walk with a limp.

Lessons From Her Mother

Ric Hansen:Your mom was an inspiration for you.

At one point you talked about the three things that you learned from your mom. Do you remember what those three things were?

Debbie Macomber:Oh my God, tell me the three things I learned from my mom. I'll be anxious to hear them.

Ric Hansen:The three things were discipline, a habit of generosity, and exercising.

Debbie Macomber:Absolutely. Every one of those things.

My mom was a creature of habit. She got up at the same time every day. She performed the same tasks every day.

And my dad was that way too.

The spirit of generosity—oh my goodness. My parents were the most generous people I think I've ever known.

They never held back for anybody in need.

They grew up in the Depression, and it was family helping family. Whenever they saw anybody in need, they were always ready to help.

The Dream of Becoming a Writer

Ric Hansen:So time passes, and you don't give up on this idea of being an author.

But then there was a writing conference that you went to, which was a little bit dismaying, if I recall. It didn't turn out as great as you might have thought.

Tell us about that.

Debbie Macomber:I'm going to go back a little farther.

When I graduated from high school, I did what girls did back in the '60s, and that was Wayne and I got married. I was still a teenager when we got married.

I just kind of held that dream to myself. I didn't even tell Wayne I wanted to be a writer.

We'd been married about ten years when I had a cousin I was very close to who was in the hospital in Seattle, at a time when Fred Hutchinson had patients there.

I love to tell the story because it's so meaningful in other ways of life.

I was lost in Swedish, which is connected to Fred Hutchinson, so I stopped a doctor and asked, "How do I get there?"

He said, "It's really easy. You go down the hallway, take the first right, go all the way to the end and walk through the doors marked 'Absolutely No Admittance.'"

And that has to do with being willing, when we have a dream, to walk through that door.

Right after that, I felt like, "Okay, if I was ever going to be a writer, the time is now."

So I told Wayne.

We rented a typewriter—which I put on the kitchen table and moved to the water.

Ric Hansen:Rented a typewriter. Wow.

Debbie Macomber:I know. That's how long ago it was.

For two and a half years, I wrote my first two books.

I joked that they got rejected so fast, they hit me in the back of the head on the way home from the post office.

I was taking $100 a month out of our family budget.

We were a one-income family. I was a stay-at-home mom with four kids, and I was contributing nothing. I was taking $100 a month out of our income, but I had not produced one penny of work.

Wayne was working construction. We could count on him working about nine months out of a year, but he had gone through a long period of unemployment.

One Sunday he came out from paying bills and said, "I can't make the house payment or I can't make the car payment."

He said, "I know you want to be a writer, Debbie, but I really need you to get a job because we're not going to make it on unemployment alone."

I went to bed that night and said, "God, You gave me this dream, and Your timing is perfect. I'm going to—this is my putting Isaac on the altar moment. I have to give up that dream."

I said, "All right, Lord."

But I just couldn't sleep.

My heart was heavy because I really felt like I could have made it as an author because I loved it so much.

Wayne woke up in the middle of the night.

"Are you awake?"

I said, "Well, I haven't been asleep."

He said, "What's wrong?"

I said, "Well, you know, I think I could have made it as an author."

He didn't say anything for a long time.

He sat up and said, "All right, honey. Go for it. Go for it."

Ric Hansen:There's a good husband right there.

Debbie Macomber:Oh, yes. He's always been my hero for that moment.

The First Small Victories

Debbie Macomber:I wish I could say, "I'm just so talented that I sold within the next month."

It was another two and a half years.

From that point on, I felt I had to at least start bringing in the income I was taking out of the budget.

I'll tell you the first thing I sold. You'll love this story.

Our youngest son was at the Christmas church program. His entire role was to step forward, recite his Bible verse and step back, which he did flawlessly—except he forgot the reference.

He was five years old, standing in front of the entire church, terrified.

He looked at me like, "Help me, Mom. Help me."

So I went, "It's Luke! It's Luke!"

And Dale straightens his shoulders and goes, "Luke Skywalker."

Ric Hansen:Oh no!

Debbie Macomber:So I sold that little ditty for five dollars.

We're in the big time!

It was my first income, and I learned that validation that is so necessary to any of us who have dreams.

Those minor little steps along the way are so important because they give us the encouragement we need.

I think you'll love the second thing I sold, too.

Our son Ted prayed and God answered his prayer.

He was so excited. He came running to me and told me all about how he'd prayed and God answered his prayer, and he was going to be a missionary for Jesus.

I said, "Well, Ted, that's just great. Just don't go any farther into darkest Africa. Be home by dinnertime."

Wayne comes home from work and says, "Have you seen Ted lately?"

I said, "Yeah, he's out riding his bike with Steve."

He said, "No, Debbie. He is on the corner preaching."

So I go out to call him for dinner, and on the sidewalk he had written in chalk:

"Jesus loves you. Ask Ted."

Ric Hansen:That's precious.

Debbie Macomber:I got $35 for that.

We're in the big time!

I started selling dozens of articles.

My goal was to get something in the mail every single day to provide the income I was taking out while I was writing the books.

I sold an article for $150.

And Rick, you do not realize—$150 was a week's paycheck for us.

It was like so much money. We just thought, "How could we possibly spend this much money?"

Wayne very wisely said, "You've never met another writer in the world. You've never talked to an editor. Why don't you go to a writer's conference?"

And that's how I ended up at that writer's conference.

The Rejection That Nearly Ended the Dream

Debbie Macomber:The writer and two editors from the very publishing house I'd been submitting my work to were going to be at this conference.

They had agreed to read ten manuscripts and critique them in front of the group.

Mine was chosen as one of the ten.

This was the fourth book I'd written. I'd been writing for five years.

I loved this story. I felt if this story didn't sell, I didn't know if anything I wrote would ever sell.

When I arrived, the editor who had read my manuscript said, "One of the manuscripts that I've read shows a lot of promise."

It was all I could do not to raise my hand and say, "That would be me."

It wasn't me.

She had the whole room laughing at what she said was the infeasibility of my plot.

She could have said the writing was immature because I had to learn to be a writer. I've always been the storyteller.

But if she had said the writing was immature, I could have accepted that.

But the story—the story.

I went up to her afterward and said, "If I rewrote it, would you look at it again? Would you give me another chance?"

I was willing to do anything.

She looked at me, and even after all these years, I'll never forget the way she leaned forward, put her hand on my forearm, looked me straight in the eye and said:

"Throw it away. Throw it away."

Five years I had invested.

Ric Hansen:And so, but that wasn't the end of that story, because the story itself turned out to be a huge success, right?

"Every Manuscript Has a Home"

Debbie Macomber:It did.

And this is just so amazing.

If I've ever seen God's hand in my life—and I have many, many times—this is probably one of the most profound moments of my life.

I went back to the conference to get a refund. They didn't give refunds.

I said, "I'm not wasting this money."

Everything I'd sold had been about the kids, so I thought maybe I'm supposed to write for kids.

I went to a workshop, and one of the ladies in the workshop said:

"Every manuscript has a home. Your job is to find it."

That was just a little bit of encouragement, and I grabbed hold of it.

I went home that very day and wrote a query letter, which just tells the idea of the book, enclosed a self-addressed stamped envelope and sent it off to another publisher.

Every day I waited for a response.

None came.

And none came.

And none came.

Every time I looked at that manuscript, all those ugly voices I had heard growing up came back:

"Debbie's a nice little girl..."

All those negative, ugly voices.

One day I said, "I cannot stand to listen to that. I don't care if New York wants to see this manuscript or not. I'm mailing it off."

So I took the kids into the station wagon, drove to the post office, and the whole time I was in line my stomach was in knots.

I was thinking, "Oh my goodness, I'm taking $10 out of our budget. We're living on $150. What are we going to do if this is just a waste of money?"

I mailed it off.

The kids and I came home.

Our son Ted ran to the mailbox and said, "Mom, that letter you've been waiting for is here."

I stood in the middle of the street, tore open the envelope, and on the paper, in a Sharpie pen, the editor wrote:

"Do not mail us your manuscript."

Ric Hansen:Oh no. Oh my gosh.

Debbie Macomber:Talk about being discouraged.

I just went down. I went back and laid down on the sofa. I couldn't move.

I was so depressed.

"What have I done?"

I said, "Lord, I don't think I can do this anymore. I don't think I can take this kind of rejection after rejection after rejection and put myself and my family through this."

And yet, a month later, September 29th, 4:39 in the afternoon, the editor called from New York and bought the book.

If I had waited a half hour, I would never have mailed it off.

Ric Hansen:Oh my gosh. Talk about God's timing.

Debbie Macomber:God's timing, absolutely.

So that was how I got started.

And then the editor loved the book so much she said, "Do you happen to have anything else in your drawer?"

I said, "I happen to have three other books."

And they bought all three.

Knowing She Had "Made It"

Ric Hansen:When did this whole thing snowball? When did you really know that you were a successful author?

Debbie Macomber:I love this. This is my favorite question.

There are certain marks along the way—when you make one bestseller list, or the USA Today list, or when you hit the New York Times list, or when you hit number one on the New York Times list.

But I really knew that I had made it as an author when my name and the title of my book were an answer on Jeopardy!

Ric Hansen:That's cool.

Staying True to Her Values

Ric Hansen:Your genre is romance novels, but they're romance novels in a very romantic—and use the term wholesome—kind of way.

Did you ever have pressure from the industry to make them a little more racy or graphic?

Debbie Macomber:Not so much pressure, but I had been pigeonholed into a certain area of writing—what they call traditional romances.

Everything was very much a Hallmark movie. There was a very set course.

I had to break out of that.

I didn't do it with sex.

I always, if my characters went to bed together, they were married.

I always stayed true to my values.

They never pressured me, but they wouldn't allow me out of that one traditional kind of romance.

I wanted to expand and grow as an author with bigger plot lines and longer books.

From Books to Hallmark and Television

Ric Hansen:Speaking of Hallmark, your books have become Hallmark movies at least five times, if I'm not mistaken.

You also had the television series based on your book Cedar Cove, which ran for three seasons and won some awards.

I'd love to hear how they approached you. How did that all come about?

Debbie Macomber:My entire movie career goes to an intern—because of an intern.

She was working for a producer, and he wanted to do a Christmas movie.

He'd been doing a lot of true crime stuff and wanted something a little more upbeat.

So he assigned this intern to read every Christmas book she could find and choose the one she thought would make the best movie.

She took this assignment very seriously.

She picked a book called Mrs. Miracle, which is based on Hebrews 13:2, where we entertain angels unaware.

She took it to him and said, "This is the book."

He looked at it, read the back cover and said, "Yeah, I don't really think this is it."

She said, "You know, I read 25 books. Out of all the books, this one stood out. At least read it."

He read it and came back and said, "You're right. This is going to make a great movie."

Mrs. Miracle became the third-highest-rated Hallmark movie ever produced.

The subsequent movies were all rated very high.

Hallmark knew they were going to have to get into the series business. Streaming was coming on, and they knew they were going to have to do a series.

So they went with Cedar Cove, and because I had had so many high ratings, they chose that series.

I'm just very grateful to have had that opportunity.

Ric Hansen:It starred Andie MacDowell, so she was a frontline actress.

And you had an opportunity to be involved in the television series a bit, right?

Debbie Macomber:Yeah, I did. I made about three guest appearances on it.

And I'm actually a member of the actors' guild. I even get royalties for my one line.

Ric Hansen:Really? You actually had a line?

Debbie Macomber:A speaking line, yes.

It was great fun because a bunch of my friends came up and were in the audience in the courtroom.

My boys were in scenes too. My children.

Ric Hansen:What was your line?

Debbie Macomber:"Yes, Your Honor."

Ric Hansen:That's fantastic.

And what was Andie MacDowell like? Did you get to know her much?

Debbie Macomber:Yeah, I got to spend quite a bit of time with her over the years, over the three years that the series was on.

To give you an example of the kind of person she is, I came on set for my one line, and I had my own trailer with "Debbie Macomber" on it.

I went in there and there was a dozen roses with a card from Andie MacDowell.

She said, "I thank God for you every day."

Ric Hansen:Oh, how nice.

Scripture in Her Stories

Ric Hansen:You mentioned a moment ago about Scripture being the basis for a book, but that's not the only time Scripture has played a role in your books, if I understand correctly.

Debbie Macomber:That's right.

The very first ones were from the 23rd Psalm—the three angels named Shirley, Goodness and Mercy.

Everybody thinks I named them after my cousin Shirley, but no.

They are prayer ambassadors, and when they come to Earth, they have to teach the humans a lesson before they can answer the prayers.

Faith Challenges and Unanswered Prayer

Ric Hansen:Along the way there have been lots of answers—prayers that were answered, and even things you didn't pray for that God surprised you with.

Was there ever a time where there was a struggle with unanswered prayers or a faith challenge?

Debbie Macomber:I think in any Christian's life—or anybody who walks with the Lord for any length of time—there are going to be times of struggle with faith.

There were some back in the '80s.

Every major New York publisher jumped on board and started publishing what was known as category romance, which meant these books came out like magazines. They were there for a month and then they were gone.

I used to say my books had the shelf life of cottage cheese.

All the companies got bought out, and they were dropping authors left and right.

That was a very scary time for me as an author because our family had come to depend on that income.

We just didn't know if I was going to be able to maintain it and be kept on by the publisher.

Gratefully and thankfully, I was.

Debbie's Daily Prayer and Writing Routine

Ric Hansen:Not to get too personal, but I think it's always interesting to talk to Christian-based folks and find out a little more about their prayer life and rituals.

Is prayer a daily part of your routine? Is there a certain place you like to pray?

Debbie Macomber:I think COVID changed quite a bit about the way my daily routine goes.

I used to go to the pool to swim every day.

Because my grandparents were farmers—and I'm the granddaughter of immigrants—I have that early-morning gene.

This morning Wayne and I were up at 3:30.

Usually I sleep until at least 4:00 or 4:30 now.

Before COVID, my alarm was set for 3:45.

Now I've got all my devotional books on my iPad.

We're staying at our waterfront home now, and it's much smaller than the other house, so I don't have a big space for all my devotional books.

I sit in a chair and do my devotions.

I have about nine devotional books that I routinely read.

Right now I'm also reading Charles Stanley's book on a servant's heart.

I have a nonfiction book that I read in addition to the devotions.

That takes about an hour.

Then I take a pause, feed Wayne breakfast and get dressed.

Then I do the writing portion.

I have read through the Bible probably for the last 25 years—read through the entire Bible.

After our son died, I decided I would do a Bible for each one of the grandchildren.

This year I'm doing the Bible for Colin, who is 13.

As I read through the Bible in our Bible-reading program, I make little notes to them—little bits of wisdom and things I've learned through Bible study through the years.

For example, I was reading today in Matthew, and Jesus healed all the people.

The little note I left Colin was:

"Colin, Jesus never turned anyone away. He's never going to turn you away either."

At the end of each book, I write him a letter.

I tell him, "This is your year," and share all my prayers for him.

At the end of each book, I share the wisdom I've gained from that book.

That takes about another half hour.

Then I have three journals that I write in.

This is my writing time.

I write in my journal.

I've kept a journal from the time I was in grade school. From the time I learned to write, I started keeping a journal.

My first sale was my brother, who, when I was in eighth grade, made copies of my diary and sold it to the boys in my class.

Ric Hansen:An entrepreneur in the family.

Debbie Macomber:Yes!

In my journal, I memorize a verse a week.

I write the verse first, then what I did that day and my thoughts.

Then there's my prayer journal, and then there's my gratitude journal.

Knitting and World Vision

Ric Hansen:Let's talk briefly about your charity work because I know that's an important part of your life.

You work with World Vision, and it's all about knitting.

Debbie Macomber:Isn't that funny? I have the yarn to prove I'm a knitter too.

Oh my goodness, do I have the yarn!

One of the things I've noticed is that, by nature, knitters just seem to be generous people.

Having the ability to give something to someone that has been personally made by them has a tremendous impact on those who receive it.

It's called Knit One, Bless Two.

You knit one item, you're blessed by what you've done, and whoever receives it is blessed.

I had the opportunity to hand out sweaters in Kenya.

You think in Africa they don't need sweaters because it's on the equator and it's hot.

But when you get up in the mountains, it is cold. It is really cold.

The joy and the smiles on the faces of these children—I mean, it just gets your heart.

"Somebody knitted this for you, and they did it with love because they love Jesus."

Being able to share my faith and a knitted item—I don't think there's anything better.

The "Magic Ingredient"

Ric Hansen:Last question.

I know you've got a busy schedule. You've got a lot of writing to do yet today, probably.

You've described what you feel is kind of a unique reason why your books have sold so well over the years and why you've maintained this great audience of readers.

What is that magic ingredient?

Debbie Macomber:I really think it is the fact that I pray over each book.

I ask God to give me the story ideas, and every day before I write, I ask Him to lead—to guide my words.

I've always stayed true to my values.

I care about my readers.

I learned so many lessons from my father, who was a business owner.

When you're growing up, you don't think, "Oh, that's a valuable business lesson." It's just part of growing up.

My dad always took care of his customers.

I was probably the very first author to ever put their mailing address in a book.

Maintaining contact with readers has always been important to me.

I've gotten some really ugly letters through the years.

I'm ashamed to tell you this, but a lot of them are from Christians who will say something like, "You used the word hell. I thought you were a Christian."

My first thought was to defend myself and say, "Listen, hell is in the Bible. It's right there."

But I thought about the proverb that says, "A soft answer turns away wrath."

So I write them back and say, "I thank you for your honesty. I'm sorry you're offended. And I know that you spent your hard-earned money on this book, so tell me what charity you would like, and I will donate that amount of money to that charity."

Except with one exception, I've gotten back letters saying, "I so regret writing you. I should never have said the things I did. I was having a bad day."

And how true it is—a soft answer turns away wrath.

What's Next?

Ric Hansen:Let's leave it at that.

You're working on a book now. I'm assuming you're always working on a book, right?

What's the current project that we can support you on?

Debbie Macomber:It's called Dear Santa. It'll be out next Christmas.

Ric Hansen:And you also have the magazine, the online magazine. That's kind of a cool thing that's fairly new, right?

Debbie Macomber:Yes. I think this is its third year now.

We're gaining, but getting into the magazine business is a tough business.

We don't do advertising. It's about 60 pages, all content.

Ric Hansen:Is it free to viewers, or do they pay for it?

Debbie Macomber:We get one free issue at Christmas time.

Otherwise it's $19.95 a year for six issues.

Ric Hansen:A very reasonable price for sure.

And if we wanted to learn more about that or learn more about you or keep up with what's going on in your life, what's the best way?

Debbie Macomber:If they want to know more about me, they just need to ask you.

Just go to my webpage, DebbieMacomber.com. It's all there.

Closing

Ric Hansen:It's such a joy.

I'm looking forward to sharing this with the world.

Thank you so much for your time, Debbie. This has just been wonderful, and you are such an inspiration yourself.

Thank you so much.

Debbie Macomber:You are so welcome.

Thank you, Rick, and hello to everybody.

God bless.