Bob Biehl: What’s God Got to Do with Business?

Listen right here, right now:

Watch it, right here, right now:

Bobb Biehl has been sharing common sense (God inspired) mentoring to business executives for the past 40+ years. Over 500 companies and churches and 5000 executives have reached out to this brilliant behind-the-scenes leader for guidance. His mission is to strengthen leaders and provide support helping them to grow their organizations on solid, tested principals. In our conversation, Bobb shares how his doubt-filled teen years pivoted to a real rock solid faith in college due in large because of the writings of Tom Skinner and Dr. John Lennox. Throughout the years he has integrated Christian beliefs into corporate and Christian management styles not by preaching, but by modeling a Christ-like philosophy in business leadership. Bobb has written 23 books. You'll find his well read book "Decade by Decade"will open your eyes with a new perspective on where you are at in life from a broader overview. Bobb will give you a glimpse as he shares his story. What has God got to do with business...a lot! And you'll hear a little about how right here on episode 51 of Amazing Greats.

"Amazing Greats" is a library of interviews with highly successful people who have amazing career and life stories and who share how God has impacted their journey. Hosted by broadcaster Ric Hansen & produced by Klem Daniels. Available on Apple, Spotify, iHeart, Google and our YouTube Channel. Please help us grow our audience by "liking", "subscribing and "Sharing". Thanks so much.

BOBB BIEHL AT A GLANCE

Executive Mentor • Leadership Consultant • Author • Christian Business Mentor

Topics

Executive mentoring • Leadership • Faith • Goal setting • Problem solving • Calling • Church growth • Decade by Decade • God’s providence

His Faith Journey

Christian upbringing → Teenage doubts → Intellectual examination of faith → Renewed belief → Mature Christian faith → Modeling faith through leadership and mentoring

This Episode Explores

• Bobb Biehl's unusual name

• His journey from World Vision to executive mentoring

• Why leaders seek wisdom rather than age

• Integrating Christian faith into business

• Modeling faith instead of preaching

• Why leaders don't have to be goal-setters

• Goal-oriented vs. problem-oriented vs. opportunity-oriented people

• His perspective on church growth and leadership

• The predictable patterns of each decade of life

• Decade by Decade and maximizing later life

• Life confidence versus God confidence

• Planning while trusting God's providence

Questions Answered

• Who is Bobb Biehl?

• What does Bobb Biehl do?

• How did Bobb Biehl become an executive mentor?

• How does Bobb Biehl integrate Christian faith into business?

• Does every leader need to set goals?

• What are the three leadership orientations?

• What does Bobb Biehl teach about church growth?

• What are the key themes of each decade of life?

• Why does Bobb Biehl say the 60s can be the most productive decade?

• What is Decade by Decade?

• What is the difference between life confidence and God confidence?

• How does Bobb Biehl approach planning and God's providence?

Podcast Transcript: Bobb Biehl on Faith, Leadership, Goals & Living Decade by Decade

Amazing Greats with Ric Hansen

Introduction

Ric Hansen:Hi, it's Ric Hansen back with Amazing Greats. Here we go—another great story.

This time, a business guy who is a consultant to executives all over the country and the world. You're going to love this guy. He's a great storyteller. His name is Bobb Biehl.

Good to have you with us. I'm going to do a brief introduction first, just to let people know who you are and what you've done. This is going to be brief, because we're going to dig into all the other stuff as we move along here today.

You're an executive mentor. That is officially what you are and who you are, right?

Bobb Biehl:That's exactly it.

Ric Hansen:Since 1976, you've personally consulted with over 500 clients and met one-on-one with more than 5,000 executives. You're the author of more than 40 leadership and management resources. You were a member of the board of directors of Focus on the Family with James Dobson for more than 31 years, as well as an executive staff member at World Vision International.

You're currently the founder of Masterplanning Group. Is that still around, Masterplanning Group?

Bobb Biehl:That's the official name. The website that gets to me is just bobbeiehl.com.

The Story Behind “Bobb” Biehl

Ric Hansen:Well, see, I'm a Ric and I have no K on the end of my name. And you're a Bobb and you have multiple Bs. You have a B at the front and two Bs at the end. How did that all happen?

Bobb Biehl:Oh, that's a long story.

When I got out of graduate school, I'd had enough academia. All my family were money people. Instead of going on for a doctorate, I thought, "You know what? I've been in this education world too long." So I went into life insurance sales, of all things.

People I'd call the next day would say, "Who? I don't think I've ever talked to you."

So I thought, the most common thing about me is my name. My dad, my uncles, all my cousins were named Bob. So I thought, I'll just add an O.

That didn't work. The O-B did not work.

So I thought, I'll add a B.

A year later I'd call people and they'd say, "Oh, you're the guy with that name. You know, there's two Bs in this name."

I'd say, "No, three Bs."

"Oh, yeah."

So anyway, it worked.

Then when I went to work for World Vision, I thought, "I don't need this gimmick anymore. I'll just be B-O-B again."

Guess who the other two guys were in my suite?

They couldn't be Bobs. They were both Bobs.

So I thought, I'll just keep it B-O-B-B so that when someone gets an email, they'll know who it is.

After leaving there, I thought, "Well, that's still me." And B-O-B is my dad and uncles.

Ric Hansen:And as it turns out, you probably didn't think about it then, but it serves as a marketing tool, really. If you put B-O-B-B in, there's only one that shows up. And so there you are. You're at the top of Google.

Bobb Biehl:It turns out to be a helpful tool.

Growing Through Questions About Faith

Ric Hansen:Speaking of family, you come from a long heritage of Christian believers. Tell us a little bit about that.

Bobb Biehl:I did grow up in a family where my grandparents were all believers. I was a believer when I was a child.

When I got into high school, I read The Story of Philosophy by Will Durant when I was about 16. It blew my faith apart.

I thought, "I grew up among farm people, and this brilliant mind, Will Durant, doesn't believe in God anymore. I thought, well, God can't be real if he doesn't believe in Him."

So I thought it shattered my faith.

But then when I went to Bethel College in Mishawaka, Indiana, I saw some equally smart people who did believe, and it restored my hope that belief was real.

I thought there was another argument that I had to deal with. Science is facts. Science never changes. Scripture and religion are just what we think is true.

Then it finally dawned on me: science isn't all facts.

What was considered factually true medically a hundred years ago might have been that we use leeches to drain our blood. That turned out to be an assumption, not a fact.

So I began to see that there could be fact with faith as well as fact with science. That restored another dimension of hope.

Then I read something by Tom Skinner that really was the pivotal point for me.

He said, essentially, that he had spent a long time trying to come to grips with his doubts. Then he realized he needed to come to grips with what he believed. He had moved from the agony of questions he couldn't answer to the reality of answers he couldn't escape.

That was a real pivotal point for me because there were so many questions you can't answer about faith.

Where is God? What is God?

There are questions the human mind cannot imagine. But there are a lot of things that are simply facts—the age of Scripture, the truth of it, the beauty of it, the wisdom of it.

So I zoned in on, "What do I believe?"

Then there was one other pivotal thing.

Probably the smartest mind I have ever encountered was a mathematician from Cambridge University in England named Dr. John Lennox. I was listening to John in a lecture.

He said there are only three things you need to understand about the Christian faith to have the essence of it.

Number one: Jesus is God—the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit.

Number two: Jesus was born of a virgin, died on a cross, rose from the dead and ascended into heaven.

Number three: heaven and hell are real places.

He said once you grasp that, you've got the essence of it.

I thought, "You know what? I'm there."

From World Vision to Executive Mentor

Ric Hansen:There's a certain element—that's why they call it faith. There's a certain element of just knowing and having the belief.

And like you, so many people, including me, need some support. You need some meat to say, "This is why I believe. This makes sense to me."

C.S. Lewis was one who really influenced me because here's a mind that is incredible, and the way he tells the story is so believable.

Let's talk about how that maturity into Christianity and your faith led you to where you ended up in your career—and that was mentoring executives. And you did that at a very early age. You were in your early 30s, right?

Bobb Biehl:Yes. I was 34.

I had never once considered being a consultant. It never occurred to me.

I was working at World Vision, and to shorten the story, the executive director of Evangelism Explosion came and I gave him a tour of World Vision. I showed him some of the things we were doing.

He said, "Bobb, would you ever consider becoming a consultant to us and help us with our literature?"

I thought that would be interesting to try. So I agreed to go see them.

The first day I did it, I thought, "You know what? I could do this the rest of my life."

And fortunately, I have.

I was 34. I didn't have a gray hair at that time.

But I found that true leaders—people who are really wanting to grow into their full potential—are looking for wisdom. They're not looking for age.

That led to my second client, R.C. Sproul. My third client was probably Jim Dobson.

At that time there were not a lot of consultants in the Christian community, so I was one of the first.

I had never met a consultant. I just did the best I could with what I knew.

What I came up with was that the only thing a consultant, attorney or doctor really has to give you is, "If I were you, here's what I would do."

Based on the objectivity of an outside person and the experience that comes with having done a variety of things, you listen carefully and say, "You know, I think if I were you, here's what I would do."

When that begins to connect with people, they begin to refer you. Word of mouth begins to spread.

It wasn't long before I was consulting.

Faith in the Business World

Ric Hansen:Was your identity having to do with Christian faith within the business community, or was there a section of your consulting that focused on that?

Bobb Biehl:Basically, my value system became, "I want to strengthen Christian leaders."

I don't care to strengthen someone who says, "I want to make a billion dollars selling widgets, and then I want to die and leave it all to my kids," or "I want to spend it on drugs."

I had no interest in pursuing that.

To this day, 40-some years later, I've only consulted with one group out of 500 where I thought, "I'm not sure they're Christians. I'm not sure the leader was a Christian."

It was a pharmaceutical company that agreed to pay my way first class, my consulting fee and everything. I thought there wasn't anything ethically or morally wrong with it, so I thought, "You know, I've got a day. I'm going to do that."

I pulled up to New York, consulted with this pharmaceutical company, and they put me in the Ritz somewhere. There were limousines and everything, so it was fun to do.

But I've never sought clients just because they're Christian.

At least half of my clients have been in positions and situations where people didn't necessarily know they were believers.

They've been accounting groups, furniture companies, legal firms, political positions and so forth. Their staffs may not have been believers at all.

One of my clients said, "Bobb, do you have to have chapter and verse with what you teach?"

I said, "No."

He said, "Because if you need chapter and verse, I can't have you in. Most of my clients aren't believers, and most of my staff aren't believers at all. I just try to live my faith in front of them and let them learn from how I live."

I thought, "That's beautiful."

So I don't quote chapter and verse. It's basically looking at a scriptural perspective, truth and life, and asking, "Is there something that is contrary to Scripture, contrary to Christian beliefs?"

Unless it's contrary to Scripture, if they've got a business principle that makes sense to anyone, I'm happy to learn it, teach it and share it.

I don't start out with chapter and verse. Honestly, it's more about what makes something go, grow and reach its full potential.

"If I were you, what would I do at this point with what I'm dealing with?"

Modeling Faith Rather Than Preaching It

Ric Hansen:The reference to God and Christianity within the context of your consulting is subtle. Is that fair to say? Or is it more—I would probably say—modeling?

Bobb Biehl:It's more model than subtle.

I would feel comfortable saying, "I'm a believer. I'm a Christian. From my perspective, this may be..."

But it wouldn't be, "According to John 2:7, this is truth."

It wouldn't be finger-pointing with truth.

It would be, "If I were you, here's how I would look at it. From a Christian perspective, here's how I'd look at it."

I'm not saying you have to. I'm just saying, if it were me, this is what I would see.

Consulting With Churches and Organizations

Ric Hansen:I love that. There's so much to be said about modeling.

And then there's questions. There's always questions. What makes this guy special? What makes him different?

Tell me about church.

Churches are a big part of what you've done because there are churches that are struggling and churches that are huge and trying to deal with that growth.

You've consulted in that arena a lot, right?

Bobb Biehl:Yes. There are four different arenas I've worked in.

Number one is larger, fast-growing churches.

Number two is for-profit companies.

Number three is nonprofit organizations.

And the other is political environments.

When I started out, the first 30 clients I had—probably 10 of them, or a third—were larger, fast-growing churches.

Today, about half of my clients, not by design but just because that's the way word of mouth goes, are for-profit corporations.

About 25% are larger, fast-growing churches, and about 25% are nonprofit organizations.

Occasionally I get into political environments, but I don't seek that. That's not what's growing particularly.

That's just how it developed.

Calling and Hearing From God

Ric Hansen:Along the way in your journey, there must have been one pivotal client or somewhere along the line where you really said, "Wow, this is the real deal. This is who I am and who I can be."

It felt like a God calling. Is that true?

Bobb Biehl:I've tried to help people deal with the subject of calling.

I don't understand calling. I really don't.

I understand concepts like vision. I understand concepts like God's purpose or mission, dream or vision, life, work and legacy.

I understand those concepts, but God calling me—I don't quite understand that one.

One of the men I've worked with quite a bit over the years is Bill Bright, who started Campus Crusade for Christ.

I asked him one day, "Bill, if you have to make a thousand decisions in one year, how many of those do you feel God actually talking to you or speaking to you in language and saying, 'Bill, here's what you're supposed to do'?"

I've had staff members at Campus Crusade guess that he would have said maybe half the time God speaks to him.

What he actually said was, "Maybe two. Two out of a thousand."

Basically, as a believer, he would look at it and say, "What makes the most sense? What is consistent with Scripture? What seems wise? What seems reasonable?"

And he would make the decision basically saying, "God, if there's some other way or some other direction you want me to go, let me know. But unless I hear from You, I assume this is the best way to go."

A lot of people feel that God calls them to ministry, but a lot of people are waiting for God to call them.

Since God doesn't speak to me, they think they must not be doing something right, or they must not be a good Christian.

I don't believe that's true.

For 15 years after I started consulting, I was begging God to tell me what He wanted me to do.

"Is this what You want me to do? Would You please make it clear? Is this what I'm supposed to do? Is this my life work?"

Finally it occurred to me that God is the one with the ability to communicate.

He can communicate through a burning bush or however He wants to communicate.

My responsibility is to commit my way to the Lord and let Him give me the desires of my heart.

So I switched it.

I said, "Lord, I'm willing to do whatever You want me to do. If You want me to do anything different than I'm doing, You let me know. Let me know it's You and not some guilt-producing pastor or evangelist. If I know it's You, I'll do whatever You want. But unless I hear from You, I will assume I'm doing exactly what You want me to do."

From that day on, I've never questioned whether I should be in consulting, mentoring, life coaching or executive mentoring.

That was a great relief to me—to be released from the concept that I have to be "called of God."

Do Leaders Really Need Goals?

Ric Hansen:That's a shocker for me because everybody talks about having a calling and being called by God to do this or that.

I love your analysis of that.

But the other thing you say that's a little bit out of the ordinary, and maybe for a good reason, is the fact that you don't believe that a leader has to be a goal setter.

Bobb Biehl:Oh, no.

Ric Hansen:That was a shocker. All the goal-setting books I've read say that you have to have goals set.

Bobb Biehl:First of all, we've had presidents of the United States who never set a goal.

I've had presidents whose names you'd recognize who said, "I've never set a goal in my lifetime."

I happen to be goal-oriented, but there are three kinds of orientations.

Some people are naturally goal-oriented.

Some people are naturally problem-oriented.

And some are naturally opportunity-oriented.

Those are equally valid orientations.

We've had presidents of the United States with each of those three. We've had presidents of General Motors with each of those three. We've had senior pastors of very successful churches in each of the three.

But here's the surprise.

A lot of leadership-development people imply, "If you don't have a goal, how can you possibly be a leader?"

I say that is nonsense.

If you're talking to a thousand people, what you're going to find is that about 800 of them are problem-oriented—not goal-oriented at all.

They set goals because they think they have to, or they're supposed to, or whoever they report to demands it.

But they're not naturally motivated or excited by goals.

They fix problems or avoid problems.

About 15% are goal-oriented by nature.

About 5% are opportunity-oriented by nature.

If you have a thousand people, describe the difference.

A goal is something you're adding. You want to add a building. You want to add something.

A problem is something you're trying to fix or avoid.

An opportunity is something that comes up at the last minute that changes all your plans, but could change everything.

How many of you by nature are problem-oriented? You'd rather solve a problem than set a goal or seize an opportunity.

Eight hundred hands will go up.

How many of you are goal-oriented?

About 150 hands.

How many say, "I don't care for goals or problems. I just wait for the opportunity to come along. When it comes, I jump in with both feet until the opportunity is seized."

About 50 hands.

All three are measurable.

But people confuse "measurable" with "goal."

I say, no, no, no. They're all three priorities.

A goal is something you add.

A problem is something you fix or prevent.

An opportunity is something you seize that was never part of the plan to begin with.

It's like apples, oranges and bananas. They're totally different.

Leadership, Perspective and Time

Ric Hansen:This is Amazing Greats, and Ric Hansen is talking with business coach and author Bobb Biehl.

I can just hear our audience with a sigh of relief when you mention that because I am there too.

I keep reading all these books that say I have to have goals set.

I actually set goals, but then I go about my business doing what I'm doing. I'm a problem solver.

Now that you've mentioned it, that's how I identify myself. I've got problems. I can fix these. I know how to do that.

I guess my gift, if I have one, is solving problems.

I love the fact that I don't have to have goals now.

Bobb Biehl:It's a great relief to a lot of people.

If you're talking to a group of people, you'll sense some deep sighs of relief when you teach that.

There have been presidents of the United States in my lifetime and yours who I don't think ever set a goal. They were problem solvers.

You don't have to be a goal setter to be a leader.

Integrating Faith Into Leadership

Ric Hansen:If you could dig up in your memory one of the most significant signs that you're integrating God and Jesus into a client's way of doing business that has had an obvious impact on that business, is there a certain occasion that was really obvious?

Bobb Biehl:I think probably the most obvious thing at a certain level is actually the church.

To have the church describe, explain and teach the role of God, Jesus and the Holy Spirit in daily life—not just teach a passage, but give illustrations, give stories and explain it—is probably the most genuine, concrete way to experience that.

Churches that teach that, tell that and explain that are probably the most obvious level.

Helping Struggling Churches Gain Perspective

Ric Hansen:What about struggling churches? Have you been involved in trying to help them come out of a slump or a diminishing congregation?

Bobb Biehl:First of all, a lot of churches think, "We're five years old and we should be famous now. We should be large now."

A lot of pastors are discouraged because they're not large now.

One thing that's been helpful to them is seeing that it takes 10 years to start a church.

Anything that's less than 10 years is still in the process of getting started.

It takes 15 years, as a rule of thumb, to become an overnight sensation—where people are aware of you and it's beginning to grow on its own.

But it takes 30 years to develop an organization—church, corporation or anything—that will go decades beyond you, beyond the founder.

A lot of people are discouraged because they don't have that perspective on time.

They think, "We're supposed to be famous already."

That gets into the decade-by-decade concept, where people don't have a good concept of time.

They think, "I'm 25 years old. I should be rich and famous already, like the guy on TV."

They've lost perspective on time.

Two well-known men—I had lunch with them about five years apart—both said almost exactly the same words to me.

They said, "Bobb, I'm 65, and I feel my team has finally come together."

Sixty-five—not 25, 35 or 45.

When I tell that story, it's a great relief to 35-year-old leaders who haven't got the right team in place yet, or 45-year-olds whose team has fallen apart, or 55-year-olds who still have two or three people they wish they could fire and don't know how to get rid of.

It takes time to build a solid, strong, what I call an all-green team.

We get discouraged when we think we're way behind where we should be.

What's normal?

Am I way behind what I should be?

Encouragement is hope for the future. Discouragement is lack of hope for the future.

When people have their perspective on time restored, it really gives hope for the future.

One of the key dimensions of leadership is restoring perspective to your audience.

Life is not just my life. Thousands of years have passed since creation. There may be hundreds or thousands of years yet to go.

There's heaven before time and hell after time.

The time we're in is thousands of years—not that time began when you were born and ends when you die.

Just restore perspective on time.

Decade by Decade

Ric Hansen:Speaking of that, which really ties right into one of your key thoughts, you wrote a book about it.

If you could just briefly go through Decade by Decade, which is one of your pivotal ideas about where we should be in life.

Bobb Biehl:You've mentioned having written 40 books. I haven't written 40 books. I've written 23 books, but I've got 50-some tools, tapes, booklets and books.

The people who know me best say, "I think the book you've written that will be the longest lasting, the most profound, etc., is a book called Decade by Decade."

I've spent approximately 50,000 hours since 1976 behind closed doors, one-to-one with people.

That leads to a lot of perspective on what people are struggling with and what's normal and average per decade.

I basically put that down into a single word that focuses each decade.

Let me give them to you quickly.

Children from zero to 10: the number-one thing they need is a sense of security.

Teenagers: the S-word is self. Everything has to do with me, mine.

20s: the S-word is survival. Can I survive in the adult world?

When 20-year-olds read the book, there's tremendous relief because they realize that coming from academia, they've learned how to work in a classroom and perform there—but can they survive in the adult world?

Every 20-something I've ever mentioned the word "survival" to has had an emotional connection with it.

30s: success.

How can I become more and more successful? How can I go up the slippery pole called success?

A lot of them say, "I want to be a millionaire."

I say, "What do you mean by that? Do you mean a million a year in cash flow? A million in net worth?"

They don't necessarily know. They just want to be a millionaire.

40s: significance and then struggle.

When you hit 37 to 43, there's often a transition from success.

"I know I'm successful, but is what I'm doing ever going to be significant?"

The first part of the 40s is often about significance.

But the last half of the 40s is struggle.

The mortgage is bigger. You have two cars instead of one. The kids are asking questions as teenagers that you never expected them to ask.

That's where heart attacks, midlife crises, divorces and so forth often happen—45 to 50—because that's where the greatest struggle and pressure are.

50s: when you hit 50, it suddenly feels like, "I've hit my stride. I know what I know. People know that I know. I'm good to go."

But there's a very predictable problem around 50 to 53.

Almost every person I've asked feels "over the hill."

I say, "You're not over the hill. I know it feels like it, but you're not."

You're looking at life a little bit wrong.

You think, "I'm going to grow until I'm 50, but 50 is halfway to 100, so I start downhill toward 100."

That's not looking at life quite right.

Your 50s are the final decade to get ready to maximize your 60s.

Your 60s are your single most productive decade.

Ric Hansen:That blows my mind.

Bobb Biehl:People say, "You've just given me a whole new lease on life."

Your 70s are your second-most productive decade.

Not necessarily in terms of travel time or that kind of thing, but in terms of your ideas.

You've got ideas that never formulated until you had a little more time to relax, rest and think.

Your 50s are your third-most productive decade.

You see what doesn't show up when you're 20 and expecting it to show up, 30 and thinking it should show up, or 40 and thinking, "By now I should certainly be at my most productive decade."

From my perspective, having worked with 40-, 50-, 60- and 70-year-olds, your most productive decade by far, given health, is your 60s.

Second most is your 70s.

Third most is your 50s.

That perspective is very releasing to a lot of people.

70s: the minute you hit 70, you become nearly obsessed with succession.

Who's going to take over what I've been building? Are they ready? Have I got anyone on board who can do it?

80s: slippery.

Is my health what it should be? Is my heart beating too fast? Is my health holding up?

90s: sleep.

I don't mean permanent sleep. I want to go to sleep healthy and wake up in heaven.

I don't want to die in a fetal, curled-up position like my mom and dad or grandpa did. I'd just like to go to sleep and not wake up. I'd wake up in heaven.

Those are the S-words that summarize the decades of experience I've had with thousands of executives.

The book is called Decade by Decade.

We sell it on my website, bobbeiehl.com.

What happens is that as a person reads about their decade, it clarifies what's normal.

As they read the whole book, it clarifies their perspective on life.

And in the 90s there's a discussion about how to know you're going to heaven when you die.

How to know you're going to heaven when you're 20 is a totally different question than when you're 92.

It takes on an immediacy at 90.

So basically it's clarification of the decade, perspective on life and faith.

Using Decade by Decade to Share Faith

Bobb Biehl:For anyone giving the book away as a gift to their staff, or as a way to share their faith—a shy Christian who wants to share their faith but doesn't quite feel confident—we're making them available through another website called Seed Planting Team.

We're making 10 books available for $20—$2 a book.

Ric Hansen:So if you want a book to give to people who are struggling, or if you're a counselor or pastor, or anybody who counsels people or spends a lot of time helping people get perspective on life, it is an incredible tool.

God Confidence

Ric Hansen:We're down to our final moments.

If you can pinpoint a time in your personal life where you felt, "This is where God really showed up for me"—maybe there is one, maybe there isn't. Not everybody has one.

But was there a moment where you felt, "Whoa. Thank you, God, for that"?

Bobb Biehl:I define confidence as a byproduct of predictability in all cases—physical, social, sexual, emotional, financial.

Confidence in all areas of life is a byproduct of predictability.

There are three kinds of confidence.

One is situational confidence.

If you're playing baseball, you're confident, but if you're not playing baseball, you're not confident.

Another is life confidence.

You say, "I've been able to figure out whatever happens in life. I can figure it out. I'm smart enough. I've got enough experience. Whatever happens, I can figure it out."

So it's predictable. That's what I call life confidence.

The third area is God confidence.

I reached a point a few years ago where I had a lot of life confidence.

My objectivity, experience, wisdom and intelligence—I could help people figure out most things.

But I reached a point where I had a situation I could not figure out.

I felt lost.

It was like I had no ability to predict what was going to happen and no confidence in the future.

At that point I remembered teaching about God confidence, and I began praying.

I said, "Lord, normally I can figure it out. I can't figure it out anymore. This is Yours."

Anything I can control, I'm responsible to do.

But this was an area where I had no control.

I had to trust Your providence.

I had to trust that You were there and that You would take care of it.

I relaxed in God that it was going to be handled the way He wanted it handled.

I'd lost my life confidence and had to trust in God confidence.

That was a major experience for me.

Ric Hansen:And then He showed up for you?

Bobb Biehl:Yes.

I've since moved to where I have life confidence in most situations.

But in any situation where there's no control, I say, "God, I trust Your providence in it."

Some things turn out like I hope they will.

Some things I'm still wondering why.

I think you can be a Christian for 70 years and still have things you don't understand.

I've been a believer for about 70 years. There are still things I don't understand.

I don't understand why God doesn't seem to show up in certain situations.

A lot of people think, "Because God isn't obvious everywhere, God isn't anywhere."

I say no.

God is working. His providence is working in ways that I don't understand.

I don't have a clue why it's working the way it is, but I trust that.

In heaven we'll understand it.

We'll understand it all by and by.

I just have to rest in it.

“If the Lord Wills”

Ric Hansen:How about a life verse? Is there one verse you lean on for inspiration or something you've carried with you through the years?

Bobb Biehl:There's a passage. It isn't so much a verse as a passage.

It's in James 4:13–15.

It says, essentially, "Now listen, you who say, today or tomorrow we will go to this or that city, spend a year there, carry on business and make money."

Why do you do that when you don't even know what will happen tomorrow?

What is your life?

You're a mist that appears for a little while and then vanishes.

A lot of people say, "Well, why even plan? We're not supposed to plan."

No. Read the next verse.

It says, instead, you ought to say, "If the Lord wills, we will live and do this or that."

That was a changing verse for me.

It isn't that we're not supposed to plan because we don't know what tomorrow holds.

We're supposed to have plans in place and say, "If the Lord wills, given health, given whatever circumstances, this is what we plan to do."

That was a freeing verse.

One time I was talking to Jim Dobson and he said, "Bobb, we can't plan because we never know what's going to happen."

I said, "What do you mean?"

He said, "I got a call one day from someone at the national news saying, 'Why you, and what are you going to do about it?'"

He said, "Why me? What am I going to do about what?"

It turned out it was a serial killer who said he'd only talk to Jim.

For six months their phone lines were lit up.

He said, "So we can't really plan tomorrow."

And I said, "Basically, a plan is what you come back to when the opportunity or the crisis has passed."

You develop a plan and say, "If the Lord wills, this is what we're going to do."

But if an opportunity comes up, seize it.

Grab it.

Then come back to the plan.

When a crisis comes up, deal with it.

Then come back to the plan.

Basically, try to get clear in your mind where you want to be in five years, ten years or whatever.

Your plan is what you come back to when the opportunity or crisis is past.

Closing

Ric Hansen:Perfect.

This has been spectacular.

I thank you so much for taking the time and sharing your wisdom and your inspiration.

You are, as George Tolls says, just a wonderful guy and very wise and knowledgeable.

I appreciate your time, and our audience will appreciate the time as well.

Thank you, Bobb Biehl.

Bobb Biehl:Great to be with you, Ric.

Ric Hansen:Great to be with you.

Hey, thanks for being with us today on Amazing Greats and hearing that great story from Bobb Biehl.

Thanks for listening. Thanks for spreading the word about our podcast so that more and more people will enjoy these great stories as well.

You can share this, you can like it, you can send the link to your friends.

Get the word out for us if you will.

Thank you so much, and God bless.